FULL TRANSCRIPT of Bible Study - 2 Thessalonians 2:6-8
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Shaun SFGH Church Leader
Recorded on the Day
Outline
00:00:06 — Setting the Agenda and Offering Four Options
00:01:20 — Review of Previous Studies: Paul, Jesus, Daniel, Revelation
00:02:00 — Objective Achieved; Options Recapped
00:02:32 — Options Detailed; Depth vs Discussion
00:03:30 — Group Chooses Option Four
00:04:04 — Reflections on Depth and Traditional Views
00:05:18 — Antichrist in Practice; Possible Scenarios
00:05:44 — Temple Context and Declaring Authority
00:06:05 — Bible Reading: 2 Thessalonians 2:6–8 (Older Translation)
00:06:36 — Plan: Three Sentences, Four Key Questions
00:07:18 — Bible Reading: 2 Thessalonians 2:6–8 (NIV)
00:08:20 — Comparing Translations: “Mystery” vs “Secret Power”
00:08:56 — Framing Four Questions on Restraint
00:09:36 — First Question: What/Who Restrains? Initial Responses
00:10:00 — The Holy Spirit as the Restrainer; Global Scope
00:11:12 — Technology and Global Reach
00:00:00 — Opening Reflection on AI as a Tool
00:00:15 — Concerns About AI’s Invisible Power and Human Design
00:01:20 — John Lennox Reference and AI as a Moral Tool
00:03:00 — Electricity Analogy; AI’s Learning and Correction
00:04:10 — Eschatological Transition: Restraint and Church Views
00:05:00 — Traditional vs Mid-Tribulation Views on Restraint and Rapture
00:06:10 — Holy Spirit’s Presence in Revelation; Angelic Proclamation
00:07:40 — Trinity Roles: Comforter vs Outpouring of Wrath
00:08:30 — Comfort Withdrawn and Restraint Implications
00:08:50 — Matthew 24: Love Growing Cold and the Spirit’s Presence
00:09:30 — Human Evil and the Holy Spirit’s Restraint
00:10:10 — Limited Comfort, Total Evil, and Divine Wrath
00:10:50 — Romans: God Giving People Over; Echoes in Revelation
00:11:20 — Identifying the Restrained: Man of Lawlessness and Evil
00:00:00 — Teaching: Antichrist Embodies Evil; Why the Restraint?
00:02:15 — Q&A: Why Is the Man of Lawlessness Being Restrained?
00:05:40 — Illustration: Jamie’s Family and the Open Door for the Gospel
00:10:05 — Teaching: The Mystery of Lawlessness and Societal Decay
00:17:30 — Discussion: Relativism and “Everyone Did What Was Right”
00:20:00 — Stewardship of the Earth and Consequences
00:22:30 — COVID Speculation and Physical Impacts of Lawlessness
00:24:30 — Technology and AI in Everyday Life
00:25:00 — AI and the Antichrist’s Potential Use
00:26:20 — Trusting God’s Plan Amid Growing Lawlessness
00:28:25 — Limits of Human Understanding
00:28:40 — Teaching: Defeat of the Antichrist and End Times Sequence
00:30:10 — Closing Prayer
Main Transcript
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:00:10
I’ve given a great deal of thought to tonight. It’s caused me a lot of work, but that’s fine because I want us to think carefully this evening.
Cecilia — 00:00:20
Okay, we’ll forgive you.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:00:23
Let me find my place. Right. I’m going to do something slightly different: I’ll try not to talk as much and give you more time to speak. I’ve also thought I’ll give you four options, and you’ll choose the path we go down tonight. That meant I had to do four lots of work—some of it was already prepared, and some of it wasn’t as much work as it might appear. So, option number one is this let me explain… The only reason we went to Daniel is because we’re in 2 Thessalonians, and Paul mentions that the man of lawlessness appears in the temple, declares himself God, and they were correcting an error in the Thessalonian church where people thought they’d missed the rapture. Paul said no, that can’t have happened because the man of lawlessness hasn’t appeared. Paul sets that basic principle out, and then what follows—which we’ve not got to yet—follows because of that happening: because of the Antichrist appearing. We then thought about the traditional view, and the interpretation of that passage is completely different to what Scripture actually says. So we contemplated that and sat with Paul for a bit in 2 Thessalonians. Then we looked at it another way: saying maybe the traditional view wasn’t correct and we were raptured at a different point. To show Scripture backs that up, we went to Jesus and his Olivet Discourse. We looked at Matthew in particular, but there’s Mark and Luke as well, and Jesus—surprise, surprise—backs up what Paul says. So Paul gives a statement; Jesus gives a chronology of when those events will happen, and it’s the same sequence as what Paul says. Last week—you weren’t here last week, I think Denise—Jesus said in the Olivet Discourse, very briefly, if you want to know about these things, go and look at Daniel: “Let the reader understand.” So we took Jesus at his word, and we looked at Daniel last week.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:01:20
It’s like a jigsaw puzzle. One piece on its own is meaningless; when you put them together, it makes sense. Paul gave a statement—a synopsis of what happens at the end. Jesus, in the Olivet Discourse, goes from now up until the Antichrist coming, but he doesn’t tell us much after that. Daniel gives us a timeline, and Revelation tells us what happens at the end.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:02:00
So you’ve got four jigsaw pieces to understand. You can skim over them, which we have, or you can go on and on.
Cecilia — 00:02:10
Well, it’s got to be like that, isn’t it? Because it’s all in the Bible.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:02:13
My personal view is we’ve achieved the objective: Daniel supports Jesus; Jesus says the same as Paul. It doesn’t matter where else we go. I don’t think you were here, but everyone else got a piece of paper with a chart and 36 pieces of Scripture. If you want to go deeper, there are those 36 other passages, because if we did all of them, we’d be here till—well, till Jesus came again, wouldn’t we? So I’m going to suggest, although I’ve already prepared something, that we’ve probably gone deep enough for what we need. Option one is that we can go deeper if you want. I think that’s probably not wise because it’s not the right audience; if we were taking a theology diploma, fine—but we’re not, and we’d be going off the beaten track.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:02:32
So that’s option one. Option two is that Brian and I have done a lot of talking; nobody else has, and I understand it’s a difficult concept to wrap your head around—especially when you start talking about weeks of years, like we were last week with Daniel. So we could open the floor to others, make sure we’ve all understood at whatever level, and have questions and a bit of discussion. Option three is to look at the flip side of the coin. I said at the beginning I’d tell you a mid-tribulation view, and I think that’s the correct interpretation of Scripture. I’ve spent three weeks looking at Jesus, Daniel, Paul, and bits of Revelation to underpin it—it’s not something I’ve pulled from the back of my mind; I’m basing it on Scripture and I’ve given you other passages. I think that’s the scriptural view and the correct interpretation. But we could look at the traditional view—the flip side—see what it is, what little Scripture it’s based on, and why it’s been taken out of context. Or we could move on to 2 Thessalonians 2:6–8. Those are your four options, and I’ve written something for each of them.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:03:30
It’s up to you. Whatever we don’t use tonight, I’ll write a summary and put it on Blogspot for reference if anyone wants to delve deeper outside of this meeting. Cecilia?
Cecilia — 00:03:40
Can we do option four, please? That’s what I’m going to say.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:03:44
Yeah, I’m happy with that.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:03:47
I think to go into it any more deeply, Shaun, at this point, would just confuse us a bit more. What you’ve done so far has opened up new thoughts to us. There’s good evidence to support it. We’ve all been schooled in the traditional view of the Lord’s coming, and we’d all like it to be that—like Steve said.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:04:04
And I would as well, yeah.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:04:06
I’d rather have that one, but if it’s going to go this way… I feel we’ve gone there, and if we now open it up for us to say what we think, we’ll pass opinions on anything at all, but I don’t think we gain by going through that. So I’m with option four. This is no reflection on anything that you’ve done.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:04:26
I understand. I don’t think we need to go further into Daniel. We’ve done as much as we need, and probably went deeper than necessary anyway.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:04:35
No, I think you’re right.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:04:37
I think we needed to go there.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:04:39
To support the alternative view, which, as far as I’m concerned, has moved me on to that sort of situation. I’m now asking: how’s this going to work out in practice? We all look at the current situation of the world and the things you’ve talked about. The man of lawlessness, for instance—[I’m not trying to pre-empt what you’re going to say tonight]—declaring himself to be God: I don’t believe it will happen like that. He will declare himself to be the all-powerful one, which is effectively equivalent to God. But because he doesn’t believe in God, why would he keep declaring himself as God? He’ll say, “It’s me that controls everything,” instead of God. We can see that in the way the world is going—the different leaders raising themselves up to say, “This is the way it’s going to go,” and prohibiting other things from taking place. That’s my interpretation. It might happen like that; we don’t know yet. They would look at this at the time it was written and say “declare himself God,” and, as far as they were concerned, it meant someone who was the all-powerful one. They could even recognise that Roman rule wasn’t going to last forever—cracks were appearing even when Paul was around—and they knew Roman rule wouldn’t last forever. So he’s looking to somebody utterly immoral who doesn’t care about anything at all. He declares himself, with apparent authority, to be the all-powerful one. Forget God; become the one to take notice of.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:05:18
And we don’t know how that’s going to develop. It could go down that line. It could be somebody like Trump who, you know, has created an AI picture of himself as the next Pope and all sorts of other stuff, hasn’t he? So you don’t know what’s next. It could be someone like that. It could unfold like that. Or it could be someone who actually declares himself God. We don’t know.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:05:44
If it’s in the temple, then okay—“Look, I’m here. Forget your own ideas about God. This is where we are.”
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:05:51
I’m not quite in Daniel’s league, but I made a prediction tonight—I wrote it on a little yellow post-it note in here. I thought, if I were choosing, I’d have gone for that, and I thought you’d choose that too. It’s not mysticism; I just thought it was the logical route. But I wanted to give you options. So we’ll go with four. I can do some predictions—I’m not very good at them, but there you go. I’ll skip the rest; it’s there, and I’ll write it up and put it somewhere else so people can read it if they want. Let’s move on. Tonight we’re going into the next piece of Scripture; we got to the end of verse five.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:06:05
Would someone read verses six to eight, and we’ll consider those tonight?
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:06:10
I’ll read it from the old hertorical—the older style translation. Yes, 2 Thessalonians 2:6–8. I won’t use big words anymore. Oh, sorry: “Only he who now constrains will do so until he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of his mouth and destroy with the brightness of his coming.”
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:06:36
About 30 minutes before I set off tonight, I tried to remember what I’d written. I must have deleted it. Don’t worry—it’s straightforward. We don’t need to go to Daniel for this. I don’t know what I did, but I deleted it. Anyhow, it’s straightforward. I’m going to do something slightly different: it prompts four questions when we get there, and I’ll throw those open to you and we’ll debate from there. When I looked at it, I think verses 6 to 8 fall into three main parts. In 6 to 8a, Paul jumps back to before the Antichrist is revealed—pre-revelation. In the second half of verse 8 (8b to the end), he jumps to the future—post the revelation of Antichrist. And in verse 7, sandwiched between those, we have an odd statement about the mystery of lawlessness, which is quite interesting. So you get four questions arising from that. Those three sentences basically cover pre-revelation of the Antichrist, the working up to his coming, and then after his coming. So they cover quite a large time span in three sentences.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:07:18
Let’s look at the first part, verse 6 to 7b. In my version it reads: “And you know what’s restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time. Only he who now restrains will do so until he is out of the way.” The four questions that come to mind after reading those three verses—my translation is more like the Authorised Version, which sounds slightly different to the NIV. Who’s got an NIV?
Cecilia — 00:07:40
Shall I read it—6 to 8? “And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time. For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so until he is taken out of the way.”
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:08:20
It’s virtually the same—just different words.
Cecilia — 00:08:24
It sounds different with different words and seems to mean something else.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:08:28
The biggest difference is mine says “mystery of lawlessness” where yours says “secret power”, but it’s the same idea.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:08:38
That expresses it better, I think.
Cecilia — 00:08:42
“And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendour of his coming,” which is pretty much the same.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:08:56
There are slight differences, but they’re saying the same thing. When I looked at those three sentences, they raised four questions. If we can answer these four, we’ll have the meaning behind the passage. We’ll consider them from a mid-tribulation point of view and a traditional point of view. You’ll be glad to know there’s very little difference here between the two—some differences, but very little. The four questions are: What’s restraining him? Who is “him” that’s being restrained? Why is he being restrained? And who will take him out of the way? If we can answer those, we’ll understand what Paul is talking about in verses 6 to 8.
Jamie — 00:09:36
I’ve heard it’s the church; I’ve heard it’s the Holy Spirit; and I’ve heard it’s Michael. I’ve heard all three. Personally, I don’t know.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:09:48
What’s your gut feeling?
Jamie — 00:09:50
The Holy Spirit, maybe.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:09:54
I think you’ve got it spot on. Anyone else want to add?
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:10:00
I think that’s where we are. Once God’s Holy Spirit is taken out of the way, there is absolutely no restraining. Nothing will turn away the power of lawlessness, and man doing exactly what he wants will be unrestrained. Despite the mess we see, God is still at work: we’re still allowed to worship; we’re not yet forbidden to meet in church. I know there are some countries where that is the case, but in this country, we haven’t reached that stage. To me, this is a worldwide thing—not relative just to the Jews or to any one nation. What God is talking about here is global, and the Holy Spirit’s presence is worldwide. So when he is taken out of the way, nothing will stop man’s evil intentions.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:10:20
You’re both spot on. Basically, when the end times come, it’s global. There’s a passage in Jesus’ teaching we looked at a few weeks ago about fleeing from Jerusalem to the mountains, which happens specifically in Jerusalem; but generally, everything that happens in Daniel, and what Jesus mentions elsewhere—and Revelation—it’s global, as Brian said.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:11:12
And obviously, with the power of the internet and electronic power—
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:00:00
It becomes doable, doesn’t it.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:00:15
It becomes doable. It becomes eminently doable now. It becomes nothing complicated. I fear the power of something—I know you’re using it for your messages—but I fear the power of AI. I worry about it because what’s happening is something you cannot actually see. It’s not obvious to you. It’s working in the background, and it’s still being designed by man.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:01:00
Me and Richard…
Cecilia — 00:01:00
Both of us are a bit thick.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:01:20
Yeah. Artificial intelligence is machine thinking. Everybody’s more prolific than you think. Me and Richard were talking about it on Sunday, and I think AI is very interesting… I’m reading a book—have you ever heard of a guy called Dr John Lennox? He’s a professor—Cambridge University? Is it Cambridge or Oxford? It’s Cambridge, isn’t it? Yeah—and he’s a…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:01:50
…fantastic Christian apologist, a very intelligent man. He’s an emeritus mathematician at Cambridge University and does a lot of work preaching the gospel up and down the country and globally. I’ve just bought his book, and it’s called “God, AI and the End of History”). Talk about deep—it’s about that thick. I’ve only just started it, but it looks to be really good. When I was talking to Richard on Sunday, I said it’s like lots of things in life: I can go to my kitchen drawer…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:02:10
…and pull a knife out to butter a sandwich and enjoy it, doing something creative with that knife. I can also stab somebody with it, can’t I? It’s a tool that can be abused. I think AI is a tool that can be abused. We’re using it—I’m using it now to record this, to help me write this up, to make it easier. You can use any tool for good, but you can also use it for bad. At any time, Satan will use it for evil.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:03:00
For me, I would liken AI to electricity because it’s invisible. You can see its effects, but you can’t see it working. Likewise, electricity can be used for good purposes; treated in the wrong hands, it’s lethal. And because AI is designed to be learning as it goes along, you see how things…
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:03:40
…work. If it doesn’t work right, then it corrects itself and makes another decision on the basis of having corrected itself. So, like when you’re dialling a telephone number and it says, “Oh, you didn’t really mean that, Cecilia; this is the number you really meant,” which might be right in some cases and wrong in others. If you dial that number and it’s wrong, it will come back with another…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:04:10
…suggestion. I think AI is ultimately not going to be used for good, and Satan will abuse it, like Satan abuses everything. Because it’s a powerful tool, it could be quite dangerous in the wrong hands. And let’s face it, if Satan gets hold of it, he will abuse it, won’t he? Big style. So, yeah, you’re right. Jamie said something really important and actually covered all three main views.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:05:00
Church a bit—you’re on next week, you’re on next week—yeah. Well, the traditional view is that it’s the Church holding him back through prayer. But ultimately, if we’re praying, we’re praying through the Spirit, aren’t we? So, ultimately, it is the Spirit. We might be involved in a bit of prayer, but ultimately it’s spiritual—the Spirit. What is it restraining? It is God’s power, which is the Holy Spirit, because that’s the One who is…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:06:10
…on earth, working through us all. The traditional view and mid-tribulation are not opposed to that. The only thing the traditionalist view would say differently is that they believe the Church will be raptured at the beginning of the seven-year period. Because we will not be here in the traditionalist view, the Antichrist will be released and allowed to reign for seven years and cause mayhem while God pours out His wrath. I would say that…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:06:40
…the Holy Spirit is here for the full duration of those seven years. You’ve only got to read the book of Revelation—the Holy Spirit is mentioned throughout; He never leaves the earth. We might have left the earth as the Church, but angels are still present, because there are three angels—called the three woes—proclaiming the gospel to those who are left behind. If the gospel is being proclaimed by the Spirit through the three woes, then the Holy Spirit is still active.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:07:00
And if God is pouring out His wrath, how is He doing it? He’s still active. So the Holy Spirit is restraining, and I agree with the traditional view there. Where I would disagree is that the Holy Spirit never leaves—God is in control for the full seven years. He’s not left, abandoned to Satan. God controls His own wrath, doesn’t He? He outpours it. Yeah, I think you’re…
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:07:40
…right. We’re back in the Old Testament now, aren’t we, where God poured out His wrath at times on all sorts of nations, including His own people. Yes, He was angry, and the Holy Spirit was around at that time. But it’s the two actions, the two persons of the Trinity—not superseding one another—but fulfilling different roles. I see God pouring out His wrath as the righteous One, whereas the Holy Spirit pleads with people to turn to God. He’s the restraining influence. What does Jesus describe Him as? The Comforter. He describes Him as the Comforter. If you read passages in the Old Testament, and certainly in Revelation, there is…
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:08:30
…no comfort in those when God is outpouring His wrath. We’ve only got Sodom and Gomorrah to think about: “Get out, Lot, because God’s going to destroy.” That was God’s wrath being poured out on evil. The Holy Spirit was still around, working with Abraham at the same time, but He was doing a different job from what God the Father was actually doing.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:08:30
Well, I think you’ve answered your own question there: if the Comforter’s not there, because there’s no comfort and He steps aside, then He’s no longer restraining the Antichrist, is He? So that’s kind of what that statement is getting at.
Solomon — 00:08:50
I think to some extent I would agree with you, because if you look at Matthew 24, the Bible says the love of many will grow cold. And why is the love of many growing cold? Because the Holy Spirit is not there.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:09:30
We look at it, Solomon, in terms of saying that the evil men do is always there. Even when the Holy Spirit is restraining, some have no consciousness of God. So the Holy Spirit is alive. But if the Holy Spirit were taken out of the world, there would be no comfort whatsoever, and man would be allowed to do what he wants.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:10:10
Now, what Revelation seems to be saying to me is that the comforting power, whilst it’s there, is limited because God is looking at man and saying, “This is total evil,” and now I have nothing to stop Me pouring out My wrath upon you because you are so evil that there is nothing to restrain you.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:10:50
Well, Romans says God gives you up to deceit, doesn’t He? That’s right. And actually that same thought is mentioned in Revelation.
Speaker 7 — 00:11:20
Same thought, yeah.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:11:20
The next question out of the four to answer that passage we’ve just read—those three sentences—and this is a really easy one because we’ve all said it tonight. Who’s being restrained? We all know the answer to that. I’m not going to say it, but I’ll let somebody say it. So who is it? The Holy Spirit’s restraining now.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:11:20
Well, effectively, it’s the man of lawlessness, but it’s evil in its entirety, really.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:11:20
Yeah, it’s both.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:00:00
It’s both. Predominantly in this passage, it’s the Antichrist, but he embodies evil, doesn’t he? So it is, in effect, both. That’s a really easy one. The third question I’ll take is: why is he being restrained? We talked about this probably two weeks ago. The Holy Spirit is on the earth, restraining the evil one from coming at this moment in time. We know that when the right timing comes, he will step out of the way and the man of lawlessness will be revealed.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:02:15
But why is he being restrained? Why is the man of lawlessness being restrained? What does it say in this passage? “And we know what is restraining him now, so that he may be revealed in his time; for the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he’s out of the way, and then the lawless one will be revealed.” So why is he being restrained? That was the next question.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:05:40
I think we’re back to what God said: God willeth not the death of any. I think it’s the opportunity that mankind still has. There is a timescale that only God knows. To me, the work of the Holy Spirit is still to bring people to a knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. God is still holding out that open door you were talking about, allowing people to get right with him before the wrath is poured out.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:06:45
I’m going to use Jamie as an example. He gave a cracking example tonight just before we went around for prayers. If you remember, Jamie was talking about his family, trying to show them why he is a Christian, and in essence, preaching the gospel—demonstrating the gospel. We talked about this the other week, actually last week: Daniel’s 69th and 70th week. There’s a period of time that Paul and Luke both called the “fulfilment of the Gentiles”, where God has left the door open—as Brian said tonight—for the gospel seed to be sown, the message to go out, and people to be saved. God knows who’s going to be saved; he’s got your name written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. He knows who will turn to him and accept him. We don’t know that; we still must profess faith and come to him. God calls everybody, but ultimately he knows who will accept him and who will reject him. There’ll be a time when that message has gone out to as many people as it can, and everybody whose name is in the Book of Life has been called and saved. Then God will call time out. We don’t know when that’s going to be; only the Father knows. In the meantime, as you’ve mentioned, we’re spreading the gospel. Jamie gave a perfect example: there are still people out there who don’t know Christ, haven’t turned to him, and God is giving everyone that opportunity. Ultimately, that’s why the man of lawlessness is being restrained—because if he weren’t restrained, and he went rampant, and the end times came, and God poured out his wrath, God would ultimately then lose people who could be saved, and God isn’t going to do that. God is going to get everyone he intends to save.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:10:05
We’ve mentioned this multiple times, and I know Denise has said it about John 10: Jesus knows his sheep and his sheep know him. There’s another passage in John where God holds you in his hand and Jesus holds you in his hand, and between the two he’s not going to lose anyone who’s saved. God will not lose anyone who’s going to be saved. So, ultimately, the Holy Spirit will hold the man of lawlessness back until God’s task is achieved. Is it Isaiah who says that his word will go out and not return to him void? If God has determined that you’re going to be saved and you’ve not had your chance yet, God will allow that to happen because his word will be fulfilled and not come back void. That’s why the man of lawlessness is being restrained. When that time comes—and the Father knows when—the Holy Spirit will be removed, and then the end will come. The last question for tonight is: who will be taken out? What do I mean by that? Why have I written that, Shaun—oh no, sorry, I’ve answered that one. It’s me. Sorry, forgive me.
Cecilia — 00:12:30
You said four questions.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:12:40
Yes, so there were four questions for verse 7. Again, I keep using Jamie because he’s said some cracking stuff tonight. In verse 7a it talks about the mystery of lawlessness. It says “secrets” in your translation, doesn’t it? “For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work.” So, what is the mystery of lawlessness, Jamie? Can you remember—were your nephews looking at that cartoon?
Jamie — 00:13:40
They were watching cartoons and then… I mean, the name came.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:14:00
That is a perfect example of the mystery of lawlessness. We’re not going to go from a Christian world—where the majority came to church, knew God, read the Bible, and we lived in a Christian nation, with Christendom increasing and growing—to a great falling away, coldness of hearts, wars, and a man of lawlessness standing in the temple declaring himself God (either literally God or a powerful man) overnight. There’s going to be a slow falling away, and Satan is going to chip away at society slowly. We’re seeing it around us; we’re seeing the fruit of that. Christian values are going down the drain. Most people don’t even know what a Bible is, have never read it, and don’t know what Christian values are. Worship declines. Morals sink. Society breaks apart, fighting against each other, with racism and all sorts of division coming into play. We end up at odds with each other. You’ll see a resurgence of paganism. Christianity will fall away because the love of many will grow cold; people will fall away and turn from Christ—as Solomon said—and turn towards all sorts of New Age cultures. We can see that happening around us now. You get television programmes with K‑pop demons indoctrinating children, talking about your soul being taken, and children grow up thinking that’s normal, cool, and great. It’s a slow erosion of everything around us as lawlessness creeps upon us until, eventually, society crumbles altogether. In all the commentaries I looked up, the summary was consistent: it’s a progressive moral and spiritual decay of the world. That’s the mystery of lawlessness—it comes upon us so slowly that we pass the point of no return and can’t turn back.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:17:30
It becomes what would be considered “normal”. Things considered normal now—even 50 years ago—would not have been considered normal then. A hundred years ago, it was closer, but now it’s very much like in the Old Testament at the end of Judges: every man does that which is right in his own eyes. In other words, if it feels right, do it. What’s your problem?
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:18:25
The word today is relativism, isn’t it? The Bible is absolute. God is truth. God’s truth is always truth; it’s not relative to what I think or what Denise thinks. God’s truth is absolute. Whereas today, you can think you’re a cat—you know, “I identify as a pussycat”—and that’s “truth” to some people, because it’s relative, not based on the absolute. But God isn’t relative; he’s absolute.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:19:20
I think that’s the thing people don’t want. They don’t want absolutes. They want to be able to flex what is…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:19:35
They write their own.
Cecilia — 00:19:45
It’s like they do it with even earthly rules. They don’t take any notice of them. They do what they want.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:20:00
God gave the earth to man to be good stewards of it, and we’ve not been very good stewards, have we? Over time, we’ve grabbed money and not looked after the resources around us. We’ve become greedy and corrupt and damaged the earth that sustains us. Because of the pollution and everything else that man has done to God’s creation, it has faltered. We’re getting greenhouse gases and the ozone layer breaking down, leading to global warming. Therefore, we’re getting more earthquakes, tsunamis, and bad weather. But, surprise, surprise, God factored all that in. God knew that would happen because he told us in the Olivet Discourse: you’ll get wars—which is mankind warring against each other, obviously because we can’t love each other as Christians as we turn away from Christ en masse—but also, because we’ve not been very good stewards of the earth, we’ve caused things to happen that feed into God’s plan: earthquakes and pestilence. I still believe COVID wasn’t natural; I still think it was an escaped germ from China, from some sort of laboratory.
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:22:30
I think some people, in their hearts, know that’s what actually happened, but you’re not going to confess to that.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:22:45
No, of course not. But lawlessness—what we’re doing—not only affects us spiritually, it affects us physically. The things we’re doing—fracking the earth (I think we’re talking about not letting that happen in this country)—are damaging the environment and God’s creation because we’ve not been very good stewards. That’s lawlessness having a physical impact. But God is ultimately in control, isn’t he? He knew those things were going to happen and he will use them to bring about his ultimate plan. However bizarre that seems at this moment in time—who am I to question God?—God has a plan for all this; he’s outlined it, he’s put it down, and we know it will happen. God will allow us, Satan, and all the factors around us to work out God’s plan because ultimately he’s in control.
Solomon — 00:24:30
It is. It does. Like difficult calculus, it breaks everything down.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:24:45
Well, Chat GTP.
Solomon — 00:24:50
These ladies go for relationship advice with the AI—“What will I do when my boyfriend does this?” It gives them advice. The AI does everything. So I also see AI as an antichrist—there’s something there. I don’t really know.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:25:00
I think the Antichrist will use AI.
Solomon — 00:25:10
Because it gives you everything. If you want to write a project—just the topic—and it can give you the entire project, perfect. At times it makes people lazy. Nothing matters; it’s just the AI. Ask AI anything; it gives you everything. I think knowledge has increased beyond measure. To me, the disadvantage is more than the advantage, because it’s making people more lazy. Students come back from school; instead of reading their books, they say AI will do the job.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:26:20
When lawlessness is at work—or the mystery of lawlessness, because Paul tells us it’s going to increase—then whatever we do, whether it’s AI or some attempt to solve fuel problems by building nuclear reactors, we’re going to fall into the trap that God is allowing Satan and the mystery of lawlessness to develop, because Paul tells us the mystery of lawlessness will grow. If God is in control—which he is—then it’s in God’s plan to allow that to happen to fulfil his purposes. We just have to trust that—trust that he knows what he’s doing. He has an ultimate plan; we don’t have an alternative plan. No—there isn’t an alternative plan. God knows what he’s doing; he has an ultimate plan, and we have to trust him. We must trust that he will bring it to fruition for our benefit, because good will happen for those who love the Lord.
Solomon — 00:28:10
In God, it is all—we can only explain within the limitation of our knowledge.
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:28:25
Of course we can.
Solomon — 00:28:30
Just within the limitation, because God is…
Shaun SFGH Church Leader — 00:28:40
We will never fully understand God’s plan on this side of heaven, will we? Never, this side of heaven. Just to round it off very briefly before we go: the last sentence, verse 8b, says, “whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.” I’d written a lot about that, but we’ve run out of time. In essence, that refers to the end of the seven-year tribulation period. The tribulation will come—whether we’re raptured at the beginning or at the end is irrelevant; we’re going to be raptured, we’re going to be saved. It’s a moot point, really. Those who are going to be saved will be saved; those who are not saved will go through God’s wrath. They will meet at Armageddon with the Antichrist and the false prophet, and Jesus will meet the Antichrist at Armageddon with those who are his elect around him, so we’ll see it. Jesus will speak, and though the Antichrist opposes Jesus, with the breath of his mouth—one word—he will disarm the Antichrist. It says here Jesus will kill him, and Revelation tells us what that means: the Antichrist and the false prophet will be thrown into the lake of fire, where they will remain for eternity, separated from God completely—which we cannot comprehend because that has never happened in our experience. They will be there, separated from God in torment for eternity, which is the lake of fire. Both of them, at that time, will be thrown there. So when it says the Lord Jesus will kill him with the breath of his mouth, it means Jesus will come and defeat the Antichrist. There is no battle; none of his elect or the saints get killed. We’re not involved; we just see it. God will do it, and he is so mighty and powerful, he’ll do it with one word of his mouth. Then the millennial reign will come—Christ will reign on earth with his elect for a thousand years—and then God will do the exact same to Satan. Then there’ll be a new heaven and a new earth, and everything will be right again. That statement is about the end of the Antichrist: he is coming, but he is also going to be killed. That sounds quite graphic, because whenever we think of God, we think of him as love. For us, he is—but if you oppose him, he is a vengeful, wrathful God. The ultimate opposition is the Antichrist, and he will be killed; he will be defeated. I’ll close on that. Brian, would you like to finish in prayer, seeing as Dave’s not here?
Brian Preston SFGH Church Elder — 00:30:10
Father, we thank you that you have all things in your hand. We thank you that you are in ultimate control. Whilst we see evil on every hand, we know that it’s you who is restraining it and keeping it back. Father, we want that to continue, and we never want to feel it—but we know it’s coming. Lord, we pray that you will prepare us, strengthen us, and give us wisdom and a great desire to make certain that your kingdom will come. Father, be with us now as we separate. Go with us and keep us safe, and, Lord, keep us as well as we can possibly be, as we give you our thanks and offer our prayers in our Saviour’s name. Amen.
# Scripture References
- 2 Thessalonians 2:3–8
- Matthew 24 (including Matthew 24:6–8 and 24:12)
- Mark 13
- Luke 21
- Daniel (general end-times passages; implied: Daniel 9, 11, 12)
- Revelation (general; including Revelation 8:13; 9:12; 11:14; 14:6; 19:19–21; 20:1–10)
- Romans 1:24–28
- Genesis 19
- John 10:27–29
- Isaiah 55:11
- Judges 21:25
# Summary
Key Themes
- Integrating Scripture: Paul’s synopsis (2 Thessalonians), Jesus’ chronology (Olivet Discourse), Daniel’s timeline, and Revelation’s culmination form a cohesive jigsaw for end-times understanding.
- Mid-tribulation vs traditional views: The group leans towards a mid-trib perspective, while acknowledging traditional views and areas of overlap, especially regarding the Holy Spirit’s restraining role.
- The restrainer: Consensus focuses on the Holy Spirit as the global restrainer of evil and the man of lawlessness until God’s appointed time.
- Mystery of lawlessness: A progressive moral and spiritual decay normalises sin, erodes Christian values, and leads to societal fragmentation.
- AI and technology: Analogies and concerns present AI as a powerful, invisible tool that can be abused, potentially leveraged by the Antichrist.
- God’s sovereignty and mercy: Restraint persists so the gospel reaches all whom God will save; God’s timing governs revelation and judgement.
- Eschatological sequence: The unveiling of the man of lawlessness, tribulation, Christ’s effortless victory at Armageddon, the millennial reign, and finally a new heaven and new earth.
Memorable Quotes
- “It’s like a jigsaw puzzle. One piece on its own is meaningless; when you put them together, it makes sense.”
- “Once God’s Holy Spirit is taken out of the way, there is absolutely no restraining.”
- “You can use any tool for good, but you can also use it for bad. At any time, Satan will use it for evil.”
- “God willeth not the death of any… God is still holding out that open door.”
- “With one word of his mouth, Jesus will defeat the Antichrist.”
- “The Bible is absolute… God’s truth is always truth.”
Special Highlights
- The group chose option four, moving straight into 2 Thessalonians 2:6–8 with a structured approach: pre-revelation, mystery at work, and post-revelation.
- Comparison of translations highlighted “mystery of lawlessness” versus “secret power of lawlessness,” clarifying equivalent concepts.
- Jamie’s family witness story illustrated the ongoing “open door” for the gospel during the times of the Gentiles.
- Pastoral assurance: God will not lose any of his sheep; his word accomplishes its purpose.
- Closing prayer anchored the session in trust, readiness, and desire for God’s kingdom.
Article recorded by Shaun Fereday, Prison Chaplain (Sessional) and Leader @SFGH Church
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