FULL TRANSCRIPT of Bible Study - 2 Thessalonians 2:3b-5 (Part 2)

 

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Shaun SFGH Church Leader
Recorded on the Day

Outline

• 00:00:00 – Opening Reflection
  00:01:02 – Tradition vs Scripture
  00:02:10 – Focusing on Daniel and Revelation
  00:03:30 – Return to the Olivet Discourse
  00:04:40 – Jesus Points to Daniel (Matthew 24:15)
  00:06:20 – Why Daniel Matters
  00:07:10 – Daniel’s Structure
  00:09:24 – Key Eschatological Chapters
  00:10:20 – Daniel 11: Antiochus Epiphanes
  00:12:40 – Daniel 11 from End-Times Prophecy
  00:13:50 – Seven-Year Period Before Millennial Reign
  00:14:40 – The Seventy Weeks
  00:16:00 – Historical Decrees - Artaxerxes (444 BC)
  00:17:54 – Rebuilding Jerusalem’s Walls
  00:20:08 – Transition to the Sixty-Two Weeks
  00:00:05 – Daniel Prophesies Sixty-Two Weeks
  00:02:14 – The Final Week (Daniel’s 70th Week)
  00:04:35 – The Time of the Gentiles 
  00:06:55 – Modern Jerusalem (Dome of the Rock)
  00:09:10 – Final Seven Years Split into Two Halves
  00:13:40 – Antichrist’s Covenant
  00:18:10 – End-Time Outcomes
  00:22:00 – “Is This the End of the World?” 
  00:24:35 – Rapture Timing
  00:28:00 – Fate of the Unsaved 
  00:31:00 – Study Resources and Encouragement
  00:33:00 – Closing Remarks and Prayer

Main Transcript

Brian Preston – 00:00:00:

Can I be very rude and ask a few questions?

Shaun – 00:00:06:

Of course. This, by the way, is nothing to do with what we’re studying tonight. (Shaun points to a chart defining end-times chronology.)

Brian Preston – 00:00:12:

No, this is just for me to better understand what we’ve got here. When we talk about the second coming of the Lord, the way you’ve laid it down here—

Shaun – 00:00:20:

The second coming…

Brian Preston – 00:00:22:

Are you referring to the time when Jesus comes down to reign on earth?

Shaun – 00:00:25:

Yes.

Brian Preston – 00:00:27:

So, within our church circles, we have always equated the rapture with the second coming—

Shaun – 00:00:33:

—to the second coming.

Brian Preston – 00:00:35:

—but the second coming—

Shaun – 00:00:36:

Technically, it’s not, but in a way it is as well, isn’t it? He comes out of heaven and meets us in the air, but his feet never touch the ground. We’re raptured. Technically, that’s not Christ’s second coming; his second coming is his millennial reign. However, for us as believers, it is his second coming because we see him and are with him.

Shaun – 00:01:10:

For us as Christians, it’s his second coming because we meet him in the air, but for the world it’s not. It never happens in that sense. His second coming, technically, is when he comes to reign millennially. It’s a bit of a moot point whether you call it his second or his third, but technically it’s his reign on earth.

Brian Preston – 00:01:40:

I’m not going to get any further into that one. This is the next one, which is—

Shaun – 00:01:45:

Oh my goodness, I’m all at fists today, aren’t I?

Brian Preston – 00:01:48:

On the chart, we’ve got vials—

Shaun – 00:01:50:

Trumpets and seals.

Brian Preston – 00:01:52:

We accept, as this speaks to us, that we are going through some part of the tribulation. Do the vials, seals, and trumpets form part of that tribulation that we will experience?

Shaun – 00:02:05:

Yes and no. Can I explain this very briefly? I think it will answer your question. This chart I gave out—if you’ve got one, and there are some here if you haven’t—was meant to make a point. I’ve only got this chart, so rather than separate it, I thought I’d give you everything, although we’re not looking at everything on it tonight. We’re in 2 Thessalonians. The chart goes into Daniel in great detail, and it goes into Revelation in great detail, but not 2 Thessalonians in great detail, although 2 Thessalonians is on the chart.

Shaun – 00:03:00:

Traditionally, the church in the last couple of hundred years—particularly since the mid-1800s—has adopted this idea, which has become tradition, that we will be raptured at the beginning of the seven-year tribulation period. We will not see the Antichrist come in the middle, and we’re not going to be here for it. I’m trying to make the point that that’s false teaching. As we saw in 2 Thessalonians, that’s not what Paul taught. The Thessalonian church fell into the error of thinking, “We’ve missed it.” Paul says, “No, you’ve not missed it, because you must first see the falling away and the coming of the lawless one in the temple declaring himself God” [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4]. That hasn’t happened, so you’ve not missed it.

Shaun – 00:04:20:

Then we looked at Jesus in the Olivet Discourse in Matthew, Mark, and Luke—last week we concentrated on Matthew. They’re essentially the same, with some differences. That teaching underpins what Paul says. Paul wrote Thessalonians before the Gospels were written down, but Jesus said it before Paul wrote it. Jesus says the same as Paul: there will be wars and rumours of wars [Matthew 24:6], then a falling away; then the Antichrist will declare himself God in the temple [Matthew 24:15; cf. Daniel 9:27], then there will be great tribulation—so severe that no one would survive unless God intervened [Matthew 24:21–22]. For the sake of the elect, God steps in and raptures the church, which supports what Paul says.

Shaun – 00:05:40:

What I was trying to say last week, and when I gave this chart out, was: if you look at church tradition, you’ll find very little in your Bible to support what tradition says. If you look at Scripture, there are at least 36 passages that support what Paul and Jesus say. The vast bulk of Scripture in these eschatological passages on the chart range predominantly from Daniel and Revelation, but also include Leviticus, 2 Thessalonians, and 1 Thessalonians. Most of the end-times material falls under Daniel and Revelation. We don’t have time to go into all of that—we’d be here for five years—but the chart shows that what I’m saying aligns with Scripture rather than church tradition.

Shaun – 00:07:10:

In the chart, there are three main points. I’ll quickly go over them—this is really for another day. I wanted to give you the Scriptures so you’ve got them all laid out; that’s why they’re listed separately at the bottom. In essence—now I feel like a schoolteacher up front—this is your seven-year timeline, that middle line there. Underneath it, you’ll see little lines with points Daniel references (which we’ll look at today). Above it are the seals, trumpets, and vials/bowls.

Shaun – 00:08:20:

In the first half, the church—we’ve looked at this already—Paul says the church will be here until the Antichrist comes at the middle point [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4]. Revelation says the same [Revelation 13], and Jesus in the Olivet Discourse says the same [Matthew 24:15–22]. Daniel, whom we’ll look at tonight, says the same [Daniel 9:27; 11:31; 12:1]. When Jesus opens the seals 1 to 6—as you can see in the first half—Jesus opens the seals. Nothing in Revelation and the end times occurs without God’s input; nothing is out of God’s control. Jesus opens the seals when the time is right, and that initiates the seven-year tribulation period [Revelation 6]. The seals that Jesus opens allow Satan to do what God permits, bringing tribulation to the earth. According to Scripture, we will be here for that.

Shaun – 00:10:10:

When the middle point comes—as we looked at two weeks ago—Paul says the Antichrist appears in the temple and declares himself God [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4], and we looked at that last week in the Olivet Discourse: Jesus says the Antichrist appears in the temple and declares himself God [Matthew 24:15]. Just after that point, the church is raptured. Then God outpours his wrath. We’re not here for God’s wrath—we’ve gone at that point. Then the trumpets are blown and the vials/bowls are poured out—the outpouring of God’s wrath—which all happens in the final three and a half years [Revelation 8–9; 15–16]. That’s God’s wrath; we’re not here for that.

Brian Preston – 00:12:00:

That was it; I just wanted to clarify: the second coming is in the middle—comes down to reign—and the wrath is when he meets us in the air?

Shaun – 00:12:12:

For us as Christians, it’s his second coming because we’re going to meet him. But technically it’s not—the second coming is when he sets his foot down on the Mount of Olives [Zechariah 14:4].

Brian Preston – 00:12:35:

There are some awful things in these vials—terrible things. There’s a lot in the seals we’re looking at here: the Antichrist, the world at war, famine and starvation, the death of one quarter of the earth [Revelation 6:1–8].

Shaun – 00:12:55:

Yes, but God does not cause that—the Antichrist does.

Brian Preston – 00:13:05:

No—and then martyrs appear in heaven—and when we get to the sixth seal, that’s the time when we get raptured [Revelation 6:9–11; 6:12–17].

Shaun – 00:13:20:

We will see the sixth seal—that’s the darkening of the sun and the moon [Revelation 6:12; cf. Joel 2:31; Amos 8:9; Isaiah 13:10; Zechariah 14:6]. I’m not going to go there tonight, but you’ve got Joel, Amos, Isaiah, Zechariah, Daniel, Revelation in John, and part of it is mentioned in the Gospels as well. We will see that darkening, and after it we’re raptured; we’ve gone. Then God’s wrath begins—we’re not going to be here for that. That’s after the midpoint, when, as Paul already said, the Antichrist reveals himself in the temple and declares, “I’m God” [2 Thessalonians 2:4]. Before that, there will be a period of tribulation that Scripture says we live through.

Shaun – 00:14:30:

I’m trying to discount and get away from church tradition because I believe it’s false teaching. I don’t say that lightly—I understand that the vast majority of the church would disagree with me. But I’m trying to make the point that I’m on the side of Scripture and not church teaching tradition, because I think it’s got it wrong. I don’t fully understand why, but I think it’s fallen into the same trap that happened at the Thessalonian church, which is why I’m trying to drive it home: we must rely on Scripture. I wanted to give you this chart because it provides 36 pieces of Scripture.

Brian Preston – 00:15:40:

I just wanted to understand the chart, the timeline, and what I was actually seeing here. You’ve answered the questions I had.

Shaun – 00:15:55:

Lovely—good. That’s one for future perusal; it covers everything you need to know for the tribulation period, which I would love to go into with you—I really would—but honestly, that would take a long, long time. Well, it’s 22 chapters in Revelation to start with.

David Proctor – 00:16:20:

Twenty-two chapters in Revelation—two verses a week.

Shaun – 00:16:25:

It’s a long time.

Brian Preston – 00:00:00:

Oh dear.

Shaun – 00:00:02:

Oh dear, yeah.

Brian Preston – 00:00:05:

That’s a lot of rock—is that a lot of tribulation?

Shaun – 00:00:10:

I think it’s important. If church tradition is right—and I think it’s wrong—but if it is right, hallelujah, because we won’t be here; we’ll miss it all. But if Scripture is correct, we’re going to see some of it, though not God’s wrath. We have to be prepared, because if everything goes as Scripture says, we don’t want to be caught out. We need to know what’s happening, and that’s why God gives us Scripture—to prepare us.

Shaun – 00:00:40:

Otherwise, why bother? It wouldn’t be in here, would it.

Brian Preston – 00:00:45:

Well, I think me and Cecilia aren’t particularly worried about that, are we, love? We’re a bit closer to home. I’m just serving my time, I think.

Cecilia – 00:00:55:

I’m just trying to get a little bit of a word in. So, tradition is man-made.

Shaun – 00:01:02:

It is.

Cecilia – 00:01:04:

So therefore, we know it.

Shaun – 00:01:06:

Yeah.

Cecilia – 00:01:08:

It’s not about—

Shaun – 00:01:10:

Well, some of it’s true, but not this element of it.

Cecilia – 00:01:14:

Yeah, that’s what we’re saying—some tradition is true.

Shaun – 00:01:18:

If you ever want your mind blowing, look at this chart and read those Scriptures.

Cecilia – 00:01:24:

And if you’ve got a year to spare.

Shaun – 00:01:28:

If you get stuck—and you will—I looked at this because I needed to wrap my head around it. It took me three years of reading nothing else other than Daniel, Revelation, and parts of the Old Testament like Joel and Zechariah. For three solid years I focused on that; I looked at very little else in Scripture because I needed to understand, and I can’t explain why.

Shaun – 00:02:10:

All I can tell you is I was driven to grasp it. I looked at church tradition, I wore YouTube out watching different preachers, seeing what the Baptist church thought and other churches, and the more I tried to understand what people thought, the more it became a quagmire. It wasn’t until one day I decided to go through my Bible with a big highlighter and mark everything to do with end times, trusting Scripture and taking it from there. It then began to become apparent. I laid everything out and attacked it—this is not my chart, by the way; someone else did it. However, I’d come to the same conclusion before I found the chart. When I found it, I thought, “Well, that’s what I’ve read in Scripture,” so I saved it. It’s got everything on it, far more than we can cover with 2 Thessalonians 2.

Shaun – 00:03:20:

I’d love to, but we’d be getting well off the beaten track if we did.

Brian Preston – 00:03:26:

We’ll get bogged down with it.

Shaun – 00:03:30:

Yeah, we will. So, back to 2 Thessalonians 2. Two weeks ago we determined that Paul was correcting an error in the Thessalonian church, saying the rapture hasn’t happened because the Antichrist has to appear in the temple and declare himself God, and there has to be a falling away [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4]. Last week we looked at the Olivet Discourse. It’s what Jesus said on the Mount of Olives just before he died to his disciples—predominantly Peter, James, and John—explaining in quite some detail what would happen in end times up until the rapture [Matthew 24; Mark 13; Luke 21]. He didn’t mention much after the rapture. What he said, as we saw last week, was exactly the same as what Paul said.

Shaun – 00:04:40:

The important point this week is that Jesus himself, in that Olivet Discourse—and we’ll use Matthew 24 because that’s the one we looked at—said in verse 15, and I’ll repeat it: “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand)” [Matthew 24:15].

Shaun – 00:05:10:

This is extremely important because we’ve considered Paul, we’ve considered Jesus, and by de facto Matthew, Mark, and Luke—and you could argue that Mark wrote down what Peter said, so by de facto you could argue Peter said it as well. Jesus himself points us to Daniel, doesn’t he? In verse 15 Jesus says, “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place” [Matthew 24:15]. When I read that many years ago, it set me off down the trail: if Jesus says the prophet Daniel said it, and I’ve got to understand, then I’ve got to understand Daniel. Jesus is referring us to Daniel; he’s actually quoting Daniel. So I believe, as well as looking at the Olivet Discourse and Paul, we need to look at Daniel.

Shaun – 00:06:20:

When I did, years ago, it opened up 2 Thessalonians 2 even more for me. Because Daniel sets a timeline for the last seven years. We don’t know when that last seven years will start—the Gospel tells us we won’t know the date or the time [Matthew 24:36]—but we do know it will be a seven-year period. Daniel lays out some of the things that will happen in that seven-year period. We’re not going to go into it in any one of these sessions, but if you read Revelation, that goes into great detail.

Shaun – 00:07:10:

Daniel lays it out for us in smaller detail, and Jesus points us to Daniel, so it’s important to go there. So, let’s go to Daniel tonight. Wish me luck, folks. Because Daniel… Who’s read Daniel among you guys? No? Marinus? No.

Marinus – 00:07:40:

Occasionally I’ve read it. With respect, I’ve had it read to me, and I read it maybe when I was a kid, but other than that…

Shaun – 00:07:52:

I know, I know—you’ve just got through it, haven’t you, Brian.

Brian Preston – 00:07:58:

Yeah, but I haven’t had a year, so I’ve not studied it. I’ve gone through Daniel, and if I’m honest, I didn’t understand very much about what Daniel was saying, particularly in the last parts. I didn’t understand much of what I was reading. I can see that Daniel’s referring very much to the—

Shaun – 00:08:18:

—to eschatological times, yeah.

Brian Preston – 00:08:20:

Part of it has very vibrant meaning, and there are a lot of strong words in there. I wasn’t using it for teaching particularly; I was just reading through it.

Shaun – 00:08:34:

Just to see what it’s all about in general. In essence, Daniel’s a beautiful story about trusting God in tribulation. The first six chapters are really his story while he’s in Persia under King Nebuchadnezzar. Then he goes into visions. So the first bit is a story—a lovely account of his life and trusting God in difficult times—and how God uses Daniel. But you find out in that story that Daniel is a man of visions, and God gives him visions. The last half of Daniel is predominantly those visions. The vast majority are to do with end times—which Paul is talking about in 2 Thessalonians 2—when the Antichrist comes [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4].

Shaun – 00:09:24:

If you look at Daniel 7, 9, and 12, they hold the key verses that relate to 2 Thessalonians 2. All the eschatological verses. You’ll also find other verses with little snippets that seem to be about end times, but they’re not; they’re echoes. For example, Daniel 11 is predominantly about the breakup of the Persian Empire, the rise of the Greeks and Alexander the Great, and then Alexander diminishes and four of his generals take over. Then another Greek ruler arises—Antiochus Epiphanes IV.

Shaun – 00:10:20:

Predominantly, Daniel 11 is about that time period and the coming of Antiochus Epiphanes IV, who actually went into the Jewish temple. He was a type of Antichrist. Brian mentioned Putin the other week, and Putin is a type of Antichrist, and Adolf Hitler was a type of Antichrist. Likewise, Antiochus Epiphanes was a type of Antichrist, and Daniel 11 talks about him. He went in and sacked the temple, slaughtered a pig on the altar, and committed all sorts of abominations. He stopped circumcision among the Jews. There was a revolt—you’ve heard of the Maccabees family, haven’t you? There’s a book of Maccabees. There was a revolt among the Jews; the Maccabeans rose up. There was a war, and they basically pushed back Rome and Antiochus Epiphanes out of parts of Israel. They took control for a short period in 164 BC.

Shaun – 00:11:30:

When they reclaimed the temple, they rededicated it by lighting candles and dedicating it to the Lord. Does anyone know what they call that festival? Hanukkah. That’s where Hanukkah comes from. It was after Antiochus Epiphanes—who was a type of Antichrist—desecrated the temple in exactly the way Daniel lays out in Daniel 11. So Daniel 11 is predominantly about an abomination of desolation, but it’s not the abomination of desolation of the end times. You have to separate that from end times, because it specifically tells you about the peoples who were there—the king of the north and the south—and it gives you historical identities.

Shaun – 00:12:40:

So, when you get to Daniel 11, bear in mind: up to chapter 6 is the story of Daniel’s life. Chapters 7, 9, and 12 are the ones that relate to end times. Daniel 11 deals with a type of Antichrist—we’re talking about an historical figure—that’s already been fulfilled. So, if we’re looking at 2 Thessalonians 2, we need to concentrate on chapters 7, 9, and 12 tonight, very briefly, to find what underpins Matthew, Mark, and Luke—i.e., what Jesus said—and what Paul said in 2 Thessalonians 2. That’s where I want to go tonight. Good luck, Shaun.

Shaun – 00:13:50:

So, marching on: at the very end of time, before the millennial reign—which Brian mentioned—when Christ comes down and reigns for a thousand years [Revelation 20:4], there’ll be a seven-year period. Paul doesn’t mention that in 2 Thessalonians 2; he just tells you about the Antichrist coming. Jesus doesn’t mention that specific seven-year period in the Olivet Discourse either. So how do we know it’s seven years—precisely? The answer is in Daniel—specifically Daniel 7, 9, and 12.

Shaun – 00:14:40:

We’ll start by looking at Daniel 9:24–27. I’d love to read through it and discuss each verse, but that would take us three weeks on its own. So, I’m going to skim through and summarise—stop me if you want.

Cecilia – 00:14:58:

Where are you starting?

Shaun – 00:15:00:

Verse 24.

Brian Preston – 00:15:02:

Verse 24 to 27. Daniel 9:24.

Shaun – 00:15:06:

I’m going to summarise what he says.

Brian Preston – 00:15:10:

Yeah.

Shaun – 00:15:12:

It starts in verse 24. I’m paraphrasing because I’m not reading the exact text, but Daniel says that leading up to the end times there will be seventy weeks. Scholars don’t treat that as seventy human weeks of seven days. They understand a “week” as seven years. So it’s seventy weeks of seven—490 years in eschatological terms. Daniel lays out these seventy weeks, and they are broken into three parts. He explains those three parts through Daniel 9:24–27. It begins with the first seven weeks—seven sevens—forty-nine years. You see that in verse 25.

Shaun – 00:16:00:

Those seventy weeks, totalling 490 years, are divided into three parts. The first part is seven weeks of seven—forty-nine years—mentioned in verse 25. History and the Bible tell us that in that forty-nine-year period, or leading up to it, Persian kings were on the throne—Daniel was there—and four decrees were made. The first decree was made by Cyrus in 538 BC—an historical and biblical record. You’ll find it in 2 Chronicles 36:22–23, Ezra 1:1–4, and Ezra 5:13. The decree from Cyrus, the Persian king, allowed the Jews to return to Jerusalem and rebuild the temple, and they did. The second decree came from Darius in 520 BC—you’ll find that in Ezra 6:1–12—and it confirmed Cyrus’s first decree, as there was some dispute about it. The third decree by the Persian kings allowed the animal sacrifices in the temple to start again, because the temple had been rebuilt by then.

Shaun – 00:17:20:

The fourth decree came from Artaxerxes, issued on March 5, 444 BC in the historical record, and you’ll find it in the biblical record in Nehemiah 2:1–8. I’ll give you all those references so you can do some homework. That’s historical and biblical fact. The fourth decree by Artaxerxes was to rebuild not the temple, but the wall around Jerusalem and finish the rebuild.

Shaun – 00:17:54:

Rebuilding the wall, clearing the rubble, and re-establishing Jerusalem as a walled city took forty-nine years, and it’s that decree Daniel is referring to in verse 25. Check Chronicles, Ezra, and Nehemiah to confirm it for yourself. Daniel is basically saying the first part of that seventy weeks is a seven-week period—forty-nine years—which was the re-establishment of Jerusalem after it was destroyed by the Babylonians.

Brian Preston – 00:18:40:

Back to Jerusalem and the rebuilding of the temple and the city under those who occupied Israel at that time.

Shaun – 00:18:50:

Darius reconfirmed—

Brian Preston – 00:18:52:

Those people who were occupying Israel wrote to the Persian governor and said, “Hey, these Jews have come back and they’re doing all sorts of things.”

Shaun – 00:19:02:

They were being very naughty.

Brian Preston – 00:19:06:

So then Cyrus had to issue the second decree and say, “No, it’s right—they’ve gone back to build the temple.” Then the last decree—this is in Nehemiah—was where they actually build the wall around—

Shaun – 00:19:22:

—in 444 BC. It’s historical fact, and it’s also biblical fact—Nehemiah 2:1–8, if you look it up.

Brian Preston – 00:19:30:

So it’s building the wall. It’s all in the past—way in the past.

Shaun – 00:19:36:

Basically, Daniel saw that and prophesied it before it happened. It did happen; you can look at historical and archaeological records and the Bible. It all confirms that Daniel’s vision from God was correct. Not only did he prophesy it before it happened, it happened in the seven times seven—forty-nine years.

Cecilia – 00:20:00:

And I thought Daniel was all about that dream. Oh, Daniel is very deep.

Shaun – 00:20:08:

He had a few dreams—he had a few, yeah. Now, Daniel then goes on to say—so that was the first seven out of the seventy weeks. Daniel then goes on in verse 25 to say the second part of the seventy is sixty-two weeks. That’s sixty-two weeks times seven, which is 434 years. The second period of sixty-two weeks mentioned in verse 25—

Shaun – 00:20:32:

—is the period from the temple and the wall—

Brian Preston – 00:20:36:

Daniel 9:25.

Cecilia – 00:20:38:

Ah, that was from verse 25.

Shaun – 00:20:42:

So Daniel—right, you’re back here again.

Cecilia – 00:00:01:

Yeah.

Shaun – 00:00:05:

Daniel prophesies the rebuilding of Jerusalem, including the walls. Once the walls are complete, he then prophesies that there will be sixty-two weeks of seven between that event and the coming of Jesus Christ. So he prophesies the first coming of Christ to earth in verse 25. That’s your sixty-two weeks of seven, which historically equals 434 years.

Shaun – 00:01:02:

That’s accurate both historically and biblically. So not only did he prophesy the rebuilding of Jerusalem completely, including the walls, in a seven-times-seven period—forty-nine years—but he also prophesied the time when Jesus would come, in years, and he was correct. He would be, because God gave him the vision—in fact, earlier it tells us it’s Gabriel who gives him the vision. So, that’s the sixty-two weeks.

Shaun – 00:02:14:

That’s the coming of Christ. Then, in verse 26, Daniel says there will be one week of seven—one times seven is seven years—so that’s the final seven years. That’s in verse 26, and that is when he dies.

Shaun – 00:03:00:

That one week is your last seven years of tribulation. Daniel says from when he gave this prophecy there would be a return of the Jews to Jerusalem that would start the prophecy. It would last for the first seven weeks of seven—forty-nine years—and Jerusalem would be rebuilt and established, and it was. Daniel then said there would be sixty-two weeks of seven, which were 434 years. Christ would be born, he would be cut off, meaning he would die on the cross [Daniel 9:26], and that would mark the first coming of Christ. Then he prophesied there would be a final one week of seven, called Daniel’s 70th week—this last seven-year period shown on the chart.

Shaun – 00:04:35:

Now, this is where you might think, “That can’t be true, Shaun, because we’ve had the forty-nine years, we’ve had the 434 years until Christ came, but we’ve now had 2,000 years and that seventh year hasn’t come. That’s more than Daniel’s seventy weeks. That doesn’t make sense.” That would be a correct assumption to make. However, Luke and Paul give us a clue to what’s going on.

Shaun – 00:05:28:

I’m going to read it—don’t turn to it because we haven’t got time—but look it up later. Luke 21:24 says there will be a “time of the Gentiles” that needs fulfilling first before Daniel’s 70th week comes. And Paul says exactly the same in Romans. In Luke 21:24, Jesus says—and Luke records it—“They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among all nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled” [Luke 21:24]. Paul says in Romans 11:25 that there will be a partial hardening, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in [Romans 11:25]. So, between Daniel’s 69th and 70th week, there is an undefined period known as the time of the Gentiles, which needs to be fulfilled—God bringing all those he has destined to be saved, through providence, to salvation—before he brings the 70th week to pass. Both Jesus (via Luke) and Paul say this.

Brian Preston – 00:06:55:

If you look at Israel today, it’s been reoccupied by the Jews. In 1949, the Jews were given permission to establish the state of Israel. But where the temple was is still occupied by Muslims who, from the Jewish point of view, are Gentiles—they’re not Jews.

Shaun – 00:07:38:

Jerusalem didn’t come under Israeli control until 1967 in the Six-Day War, but still Jordan administers the Dome of the Rock area, and it’s an Islamic shrine. So it’s still occupied and still defiled by the Gentiles.

Brian Preston – 00:08:22:

It’s a mixed re-conquest, if you like, or re-establishment of the whole of Jerusalem as part of the Jewish state. To expel any Muslims out of the Jewish state—I’m sure some would like to do that—but at this point in time, part of it is in control of the Gentiles, and the time of the Gentiles has not yet been fulfilled.

Shaun – 00:09:10:

Precisely. That’s the bit we don’t know how long will last. At some point in time, the time of the Gentiles will be fulfilled, and Daniel’s 70th week will come into effect. Jesus said, “We do not know the time or the hour.” We don’t know when that’s going to be, and nobody—Jesus even said he wasn’t going to tell us; only the Father knows that [Matthew 24:36]. We don’t know how long God has determined for the time of the Gentiles. We just know that between Daniel’s 69th week—the first seven plus the sixty-two—and the 70th week, this end-time seven-year period, there’s an undefined period called the time of the Gentiles. When God determines that everybody who’s going to be saved has been saved, that 70th week will begin. We don’t know when, but it will begin.

Shaun – 00:10:52:

That’s the first thing to remember, and Daniel lays that timeline out for us. That’s why we know that the last period of time, when the Antichrist appears, will be in that seven-year period, because Daniel lays that out for us. The next important thing to know about that final seven-year period is that it’s not a full seven-year block without distinction—it’s split into two halves, each three and a half years long.

Shaun – 00:11:36:

If you look at Revelation, three and a half years is described not as “three and a half years” but as “42 months.” Revelation refers to the two three-and-a-half-year periods as two lots of 42 months [Revelation 11:2–3; 13:5].

Brian Preston – 00:12:10:

A month is a month—we’re not going too deeply into what a month means.

Shaun – 00:12:22:

A month is literally a month. It works out at three and a half years. We haven’t got time to go into it—if you want, I can explain lunar months and how Hebrews worked months differently: 30 days, and every so often they adjusted. But trust me, 42 months is three and a half years. If you want the actual mathematics for it, I’ll bore you, but not today. Daniel and Revelation also sometimes refer to those two periods as 1,260 days [Revelation 12:6], which is three and a half years. And sometimes they refer to them as “time, times, and half a time”—“time” is one year, “times” is two years, and “half a time” is half a year—so that’s three and a half years [Daniel 7:25; 12:7; Revelation 12:14].

Shaun – 00:13:40:

So, from Daniel we know there’s a timeframe, we know we’re getting close to the end, and we know that when the end comes it will be a seven-year period split into two halves—either 1,260 days or “time, times, and half a time.” You might ask, “What’s the point of splitting it in half?” Daniel mentions the two halves because he tells us that’s when the Antichrist stands in the temple—Paul and Jesus say the same [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4; Matthew 24:15].

Shaun – 00:14:42:

Paul doesn’t give us the precise timeline for when this happens—he could stand in the temple in year one, month one. Jesus gives us chronology, but not the exact timing. How do we know the Antichrist stands in the temple at the middle rather than at the beginning or end? Daniel gives us the specific timeline, and he’s really precise. Daniel covers 490 years, and an interregnum—the time of the Gentiles. In Daniel 9:27—let me read it quickly, and then we’ll call it a close for this week—he never calls the Antichrist “Antichrist”; he calls him the “little horn” [cf. Daniel 7:8]. He says, “He shall make a strong covenant with many for one week,” that final seven years. That’s why you’ll hear people say there’ll be peace in the end times, because the Antichrist will initially bring peace. He makes a covenant for peace.

Shaun – 00:16:12:

But the Antichrist is a liar—he can’t keep his promises because he represents Satan. He comes in promising peace, and the seven years start with peace, but somewhere in that first three-and-a-half-year period, when Jesus opens the seals in heaven, war breaks out because the Antichrist breaks his covenant [Revelation 6:3–4]. Daniel tells us, “For half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering,” and then, “On the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator” [Daniel 9:27]. In plain terms, “the wing of abominations” is where he declares himself God—the “one who makes desolate” brings death and destruction in that first half. “Until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator” refers to God, at the end of the second three-and-a-half years, destroying the Antichrist and the false prophet and throwing them into the lake of fire [Revelation 19:20].

Shaun – 00:18:10:

So, in that end seven years, split into two halves, the Antichrist appears in the middle, declares himself God, breaks his covenant, war ensues, and in the end he’s thrown into the lake of fire and destroyed by God at the end of the second half. Most of Revelation backs this up [Revelation chs. 6–19], and Revelation 20:10 is where Satan is thrown into the lake of fire—but that’s later.

Cecilia – 00:22:00:

So is this the end of the world? Yes.

Shaun – 00:22:06:

Up until the millennial reign, it’s the end of this existence as we know it. Daniel basically gives us what Paul and Jesus don’t in the Olivet Discourse: he gives us a timeline up to the end. God and Jesus say they’re not telling us how long the time of the Gentiles will be—only the Father knows. The 70th week comes; Daniel places it; he tells you it’ll be seven years; he breaks it into two halves; and he says, in the middle—consistent with Jesus and Paul—the Antichrist will be revealed. Then God’s wrath will start; God will pour out his wrath; and in the end, “the decreed end is poured out on the desolator” [Daniel 9:27]. That’s when the Antichrist and the false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire, as we know from Revelation. I appreciate that’s a very quick whistle-stop tour. I think Brian’s got it—I don’t know about anybody else.

Brian Preston – 00:23:34:

For me, we’re waiting. The difference between what we’ve been taught previously and what you’re bringing now—which, you can see, has good justification—is that we believed that before all the trouble started, we would be raptured and go to be with the Lord. Now we’re saying that isn’t going to happen as we thought. We’re going to pass through three and a half years of tribulation, which is described in Revelation with the seals being opened.

Brian Preston – 00:24:35:

Part of the world is described. At the end of that, what’s left is taken up to heaven.

Shaun – 00:25:00:

Then God calls time. That’s why Daniel splits it into two halves. The first half is tribulation, and we experience that. The second half is God’s wrath—we don’t experience that, but the world does—and Daniel makes that clear in Daniel 9. We’ve run out of time tonight, but next week I’m going to quickly skip over Daniel 7 and Daniel 12, which back up, in a little more detail, what Daniel has already told us. I want to nail home that there aren’t one or two Scriptures—there are many. I won’t go through all thirty-six, but I’ll go through two more. Multiple prophets across vast periods of time, including Jesus himself, say the exact same thing: the Antichrist will come, and you will be raptured after you see the Antichrist. Prepare yourself for tribulation—but it’s not God’s wrath. Everyone you read, and Daniel being specific on dates, points to the same thing. Paul is correcting the error in the Thessalonian church, and I believe the church today has fallen into exactly the same error as the Thessalonians [2 Thessalonians 2:1–4].

Brian Preston – 00:27:00:

We don’t believe the Lord’s come. We don’t believe the Lord’s come.

Shaun – 00:27:10:

No, we don’t believe he’s come.

Brian Preston – 00:27:15:

The Thessalonians believed they’d missed the rapture.

Shaun – 00:27:22:

Yes. But when the rapture doesn’t appear as the church is teaching, we could fall into the same trap. We might say, “Oh my goodness, look at all these things happening—the Antichrist has come. I’ve missed it.” No, you haven’t. Paul tells you you’ve not missed it [2 Thessalonians 2:1–4].

Marinus – 00:28:00:

What happens to the unsaved?

Shaun – 00:28:05:

Right at the end, they’re thrown into the lake of fire, which is worse than hell. Hell is a temporary holding place. The lake of fire is eternal torment and destruction—it burns forever [Revelation 20:11–15]. Do you want the good news, Marinus? The good news is we’ve all got time to be saved. And the second good news is that even when God pours out his wrath, he still sends three angels—three “woes”—calling mankind to repent. Revelation tells us the vast majority spit in God’s face and don’t repent, but even in the last three and a half years, God gives mankind final chances. There’s still time to repent, even for those caught in God’s wrath, if they choose it [Revelation 8:13; 9:20–21; 14:6–7].

Cecilia – 00:30:20:

Yeah, well, that’s the good gift.

Shaun – 00:30:25:

Does what I’ve said make sense? There was a lot to cover in a short time.

Cecilia – 00:30:40:

It probably will make sense when I get my head around it. I’m not very good at—

Shaun – 00:30:47:

—eschatological stuff.

Cecilia – 00:30:50:

Yeah, whatever. But I’m going to read it. I’ve got my book on it. 

Marinus - 00:30: 54

I’ll just ask Alexa to read it.

Shaun – 00:31:00:

Before we go, I’ll give you a site you can look up where we’ve recorded what I’ve said. All those Bible references I’ve given tonight—you can find them and look them up.

Cecilia – 00:31:25:

Oh, okay.

Shaun – 00:31:30:

Then you can see that what I’m saying is based on Scripture.

Cecilia – 00:31:45:

Yeah, it’s scary.

Shaun – 00:31:50:

The really scary stuff is in Revelation, not in Daniel. Daniel is about chronology—he’s like a clock; he gives you lots of timings. He’s very complicated, and I think most people read it, don’t understand it, so they shut the book and never re-read it. I hope that made at least a little bit of sense.

Dave Proctor – 00:33:00:

Dave ended in prayer.

Summary

Key moments:

  - Shaun distinguishes the rapture (meeting Christ in the air) from the technical second coming (Christ’s bodily return to reign on earth) [Zechariah 14:4].

  - Shaun argues against a pre-tribulation rapture, aligning Paul’s correction in 2 Thessalonians and Jesus’ Olivet Discourse with Daniel’s timeline [2 Thessalonians 2:3–4; Matthew 24:6, 15–22; Daniel 9:24–27].

  - Detailed overview of Daniel’s seventy weeks, including historical decrees and the interlude called the time of the Gentiles [2 Chronicles 36:22–23; Ezra 1:1–4; Ezra 5:13; Ezra 6:1–12; Nehemiah 2:1–8; Luke 21:24; Romans 11:25].

  - Clarification that believers will experience the first-half tribulation (seals) but be raptured before God’s wrath (trumpets and bowls) [Revelation 6; 8–9; 15–16].

Themes:

  - Scripture over church tradition for eschatology.

  - God’s sovereignty in end-times events (Jesus opens the seals) [Revelation 6].

  - Chronology and markers: abomination in the temple at the midpoint; two halves of 42 months/1,260 days [Daniel 9:27; Revelation 11:2–3; 12:6, 14; 13:5].

Memorable quotes:

  - “For us as Christians, it’s his second coming because we meet him in the air, but technically it’s not—his second coming is when he sets his foot down on the Mount of Olives” [Zechariah 14:4].

  - “If you look at church tradition, you’ll find very little in your Bible to support what tradition says.”

Scripture focus:

  - 2 Thessalonians 2:3–4; Matthew 24:6, 15–22; Daniel 9:24–27; Daniel 7, 12; Revelation 6; 8–9; 15–16; Zechariah 14:4; Joel 2:31; Amos 8:9; Isaiah 13:10.

Special highlights:

  - Historical context of Daniel 11 and Antiochus Epiphanes as a type of Antichrist connected to Hanukkah; distinction from the future abomination Jesus references [Daniel 11; Matthew 24:15].

  - Assurance of opportunities to repent even during God’s wrath via angelic proclamations [Revelation 8:13; 9:20–21; 14:6–7].

Article recorded by Shaun Fereday, Prison Chaplain (Sessional) and Leader @SFGH Church